Deadly meningitis hits gay men in NYC, mass vaccinations recommended

A particularly deadly meningitis outbreak among gay men in New York City has led the city to recommend that every gay man who is basically sexually active, and not in an exclusive relationship, to get a meningitis vaccination pronto.

Per the CDC, “Meningitis is a disease caused by the inflammation of the protective membranes covering the brain and spinal cord known as the meninges.”

The alert was issued two weeks ago – I didn’t hear a word about it until yesterday when Michael Broder at the Huffington Post wrote about it.

The New York City Health Department’s recommendation for who should get vaccinated is written a bit oddly, but here goes:

The Health Department issued new recommendations today for vaccinating against invasive meningococcal disease – commonly known as meningitis – after an increase in cases. Vaccinations are now advised for men, regardless of HIV status, who regularly have intimate contact with other men met through a website, digital application (“App”), or at a bar or party.

To me, this means anyone who is gay, sexually active and not monogamous with someone else who is also monogamous.

Disease meningitis

Meningococcus via Shutterstock

New York City’s Health Commissioner, Dr. Thomas Farley, notes that “Meningitis symptoms usually come on quickly, and the disease can be fatal if not treated right away.”  An article in yesterday’s NYT notes that while typically meningitis kills one in five people it strikes, this strain kills one in three.

A reader who sent me the Times story remarked, “awfully scary — takes me back to 1982.”  He means the beginning of the AIDS crisis, when gay men in big cities were mysteriously becoming ill.  Hopefully, we’re not facing a new epidemic, but in any case, even though I live in DC, I’m talking to my doctor this week when I go in for my allergy shot.  I recommend some of you do the same.

More from the NYC press release:

Vaccination prevents, but does not treat, current infection. Common symptoms of meningitis are: high fever, headache, stiff neck, and rash that develop rapidly upon onset. Symptoms may occur two to 10 days after exposure, but usually within five days. Meningitis can be fatal if not treated promptly. People who experience these symptoms should seek medical care immediately.

And before the religious right gleefully uses this as justification for why gays shouldn’t be permitted to marry (oh, and they will), perhaps if generations upon generations of gay men weren’t brought up in a society that did not permit them to marry, and a culture that taught them from an early age that they would never find romantic love, and would likely lose the love of their family and friends if they ever found out who they really were, more gay men would be settled down in couples and not prone to getting such diseases that tend to better proliferate when one is not monogamous.  If anything, hatred and bigotry helped fuel this disease more than anything else.

And while NY state now has marriage equality for gays, it’s going to take more than nine months of legalized same-sex marriages to wipe out the psychological damage caused by millenia of intolerance.

Follow me on Twitter: @aravosis | @americablog | @americabloggay | Facebook | Instagram | Google+ | LinkedIn. John Aravosis is the Executive Editor of AMERICAblog, which he founded in 2004. He has a joint law degree (JD) and masters in Foreign Service from Georgetown; and has worked in the US Senate, World Bank, Children's Defense Fund, the United Nations Development Programme, and as a stringer for the Economist. He is a frequent TV pundit, having appeared on the O'Reilly Factor, Hardball, World News Tonight, Nightline, AM Joy & Reliable Sources, among others. John lives in Washington, DC. .

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262 Responses to “Deadly meningitis hits gay men in NYC, mass vaccinations recommended”

  1. Goldilocks says:

    Do you actually think this is a result of the state not allowing gays to marry? I think this bizarre enforcement of heterosexual monogamy on gay people is why infection continues in the first place. Nearly all of us have unprotected sex with our long term partners and infection comes when someone cheats, doesn’t use protection and then keeps quiet because they’ve broken some archaic rules about monogamy. Gay marriage is understandably important for some but dont mistake it for disease prevention. And all the homophobes here sound like they need to get laid. What a bunch of puritans.

  2. Sam Waterson says:

    ‘gleefully ” ? Are you insane ? Promiscuous sex leads to disease . This is a scientific fact .
    When people get ill from their irresponsible behavior , it’s a sad thing , even horrifying
    in the case of something like this or A.I.D.S.

    Take some responsibility for your behavior instead of blaming it on some other group –
    no one forced you to have unprotected , promiscuous sex .

  3. silvermaran says:

    They can’t tell you what causes Meningitis anymore than than can tell you what caused AIDS. Because after they infected us all with gene sharing spirochetal prion protein infections in contaminated vaccines for over 35yrs. rigged the tests to Rule Out the real cause of AIDS we got hundreds of syndromes to cover up their crimes. All they are doing with the vaccines is trying to keel you faster by adding to the prion synergy of spirochetal disease that does not care what it shares its genes with.
    Which is why they lied about Autism babies forcing them to suffer multiple infections and NO treatment—because we were already infected from contaminated vaccines.

  4. Thanks, You Are Too. says:

    Why do we need to blame The Right or blame the history of homophobia for the simple fact that guys enjoy having sex with each other—gay, bi, straight, whatever. Blaming a third party implies we should be ashamed of this simple biological fact.

    Act like adults and get vaccinated, practice safe sex, get HIV tests regularly and enjoy this free pleasure. Jeez

  5. d3clark says:

    Epidemiologists have just found a link between MSMs who have sex with multiple partners and increased risk of meningitis. As I mentioned previously, it’s easy to get infected while having sex because of possible oral secretion sharing. You can’t have much more close/intimate contact than when having sex. Sneeze, cough, share a cigarette, drink, etc. and you can get it. Now, if that scene is repeated 4 times/week with a different partner each time, risk increases.

  6. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Oh, for fuck’s sake, it was typo. DOH. And since it’s not sexually transmitted, this focus on sex seems bizarre.

  7. Skeptical Cicada says:

    I can’t believe you imagine you have the moral authority to prance into a gay blog knowing next to nothing about the gay community and smugly condescend.

  8. mclarksn9 says:

    This is so sad and I hope this is clears with as small an impact as is possible. Reading some of the articles there has to be some responsibility in the gay community. In the age of AIDS I can’t believe people are still having these types of reckless sexual encounters

  9. Thanks for linking to the Huffington Post Gay Voices piece.

  10. Alex Tuttle says:

    Question: Is this deadly strain the result of – or possibly been exacerbated by – its exposure to so many hosts, trading it back and forth, who are already on SO many antibiotics… for HIV? If so, this makes me very sad…

  11. markpkessinger says:

    Thank you, John, for getting the word out on this. I just sent a group message to all of my gay friends on Facebook. I included even those who are not in the New York area, because, as those of us who are old enough to remember the early days of the AIDS epidemic know all too well, an infectious disease such as this can jump to other cities across the country in virtually no time at all.

  12. d3clark says:

    NYC DOC (Department of Corrections)? I haven’t read anything from them in regards to this. If you have a reference for a statement from the DOS, I’d appreciate a link. Thanks. Or do you mean NYC DOH? All of the documents I’ve read (from DOH and CDC) say that HIV+ MSMs and MSMs who have multiple sexual contacts, have a higher risk of getting it. A common link found among the MSMs who got it is that many had multiple partners that they met thought apps/bars/parties. None of the reports say that gays have started it or are spreading it to other groups. The DOH is trying to make physicians (and the public) aware that 1. This is infecting people in the NYC area and can be serious and/or fatal. 2. HIV+ MSMs and MSMs with multiple partners have increased risk. So the DOH is recommending that these groups get vaccinated/revaccinated. The implication is there, but not stated, for physicians to keep their eyes open to see if any other groups seem to get it, too – like HIV+ women, prostitutes, straight guys with immunodeficiencies, etc. Many docs will be thinking about this as soon as they hear any complaints of symptoms from ANY patients of this disease, hear that the patient has multiple partners, hear that the patient has an immune deficiency, is living in a crowded space, has had a close contact with someone who has it, etc.

    While it’s not technically sexually transmitted, it can be contracted during sex. Kissing during sex or after, sharing a drink from the came glass, sharing a toothbrush, etc. can all transmit it. Therefore, having sex with multiple partners can easily increase the risk. You’d be spending some amount of time in a small area with someone else and oropharyngeal secretions could get shared.

  13. It (The not so underground culture) is worse than it was back then, So many of those folks are practicing bad sex habits. A well known gay porn producer(Paul Morris) that produces condomless pornography stated in The Advocate magazine interview that the “New Viginity” are people who are still HIV negative and those that are still negative are “Bougie” and should come over to the wildside. And they keep putting out condomless adult gay media, so the kids go for it. Even in straight porn they just had a huge syphillis outbreak in LA. But in the gay world the most popular tern is NSA & BB. Pass it along with no repercussions. (They are even popularizing a tattoo that looks like the poison/radioactive symbol). That not starting an outrage was bad enough. Now the network Logo is running ads promoting the idea of not spreading HIV to one another. Novel idea. Sometimes I think the worst thing that happened was the 3 pill solution/cocktail. And its just not gays, I think all should wear condoms if not in a commited relationship and not trying to have kids. And Drew2u you are right, But many in our generation are not good role models either. The condomless porn industry should be put on blast nationally. When the 3 pill/cocktail stops working we will be back where we started.

  14. Mike_in_the_Tundra says:

    Your comment gave me a very weird flashback. When I was about twenty, I was introduced to a slightly older man. He knocked himself out trying to get me in bed. It turned out that he believed it was perfectly okay for two men to have sex, but two men shouldn’t kiss one another. I guess he wouldn’t have to worry about meningitis.

  15. FLL says:

    As a few have noted, meningitis is spread through saliva, not oral or anal sex. But you won’t let that get in the way of your gleeful stream of insults directed at the sexual activity of gay men in general. And that concluding sentence with the epic stereotypes! Yes, you do sound rather self-loathing. By the way, anonymous sex is a requirement for remaining in the closet. Christian preachers and their supporters are not making gay men have sex, but they sure are forcing gay men to restrict sex to anonymous encounters. Now why don’t you get the hell out of the way while other people work for progress.

  16. JamesR says:

    The issues are:

    A: This meningitis is NOT sexually transmitted. It’s casually transmitted.

    B: Many people must have been exposed, and could be transmitting it as we type, and be unaware of the danger because they either are not getting the information, or if they are they think it’s others’ danger because it’s a gay sex disease. Which it is NOT.

    C: It’s a WTF moment for public health, the way they’ve spread the word. And you have fallen for it, seemingly without researching, or with researching but then without caring and re-hashing the oh-so-helpful HIV safe sex told-you-so, fuck-you-if-you-don’t-behave, don’t-come-crying-to-me argument.

    Which everyone loves to read and reacts well to.

    The issue plainly is, on the one hand, certain subjects and potential exposed people and groups have been tracked and projected to interact with others in a probable manner to maximize the spread. IE contact with upper respiratory secretions (and potentially skin.) It is reasonable to alert those who may more likely contact these secretions they need to be aware and get vaccinated. Yet on the other hand how necessary was it to phrase the alert in the context that it was an STD?? Another VD like HIV and that MRSA. Which, like this, is NOT sexually transmitted.

    They dumbed it down in order to get the message out, or to reduce a more generalized panic, but then didn’t realize that then the rest of the population would not get the info they needed to manage their own health! What were the factors they considered, and / or how does the NYC Health Commission parse the value of a human life, did they wait until all five borough got reported infections and deaths, that they could have predicted, or is it that they had to scare other agencies into acting? As if the only way a vaccine would be paid for and widely distributed wold be if there were more deaths?? THESE are the issues.

    Not bath houses, buttfucking, and you being right all these years.

    Get with the program.

    – The above was more for what you’ve written throughout the thread, to the specific comment, I acknowledge I am inserting myself into your discussion, as it were, as you did to FLL as he was commenting to Jon N and not you. –

    Diagramming the concepts, the original post was waxing about how the Wingnuttisphere will use the ‘Gay meningitis’ scare in their diseased sinful blah blah blah argument you can BET they are already doing, especially now as arguments hit the Supreme Court about marriage – it will happen. It is despicable. The misinformation – explicit and implicit – from the NY Health Commission has a very real byproduct of being prime fodder for political and religious propaganda. Anyone living through the original HIV outbreak times, and especially one harping on them, knows Goddamn well what the fundies do.

    The effect preachers et al had in the spread of HIV was many fold. To boil down the argument that the ONLY method of spread was the sex for which the fuckers themselves were individually responsible for is rather intellectually dishonest as it ignores the societal and legal context in which those decisions were made. Which you purportedly already know. John the author of the original thread was in error classifying this as a sexually transmitted disease, an understandable error as that is what’s being spread by the NYC Health Commission, so his analogy doesn’t quite fit, but that’s been corrected in the comments here.

    Jon N then did a classic modern conservative indignant diversion to the defense against blame for others’ actions talking point with a follow up of “personal accountability” sanctimony and you fell right in with it.

    Since we have lived through a history where religious forces in this country and this world to this day are complicit in the spread of HIV and the issues here are so directly parallel and have been invoked it IS entirely relevant and necessary to bear witness, those of us who have survived. They still bear the shame, they will always bear the shame, I for one will always point it out, bring it up, and always explain why it’s important to those who snipe and parse or divert. Moral responsibility is still responsibility, especially in those who are purportedly called to do better. Even as individuals also have primary responsibility for what they do of their own free will.

    Yet NOWHERE on this thread has anyone eschewed responsibility for sexual behavior, notwithstanding that sexual behavior per-se is NOT THE ISSUE. Would I be as “responsible” involuntarily coughing on a stranger in public were I infected and didn’t know it, the same way as if I had unprotected sex with a stranger? No.

    Red Fucking (or sneezing) Herring.

    Which then infected your comment with a gratuitous ad-hominem which was not only pathetic and low, but also non-sequitur and inaccurate. Heckofajob.

    Sorry FLL I saw this first and had to go for it like a blogsneeze MyBad

  17. Mike_in_the_Tundra says:

    Proofread much?

  18. Mike_in_the_Tundra says:

    Of course they’re all monogamous. The moon is also made of green cheese.

  19. Mike_in_the_Tundra says:

    Those of us that survived the plague have a healthy respect for safer sex. Those taking these chances have not seen the horrors that we have. I wish them the best and hope that they will be safe despite their behavior.

  20. Skeptical Cicada says:


  21. Skeptical Cicada says:


  22. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Um, yeah, thanks, Sherlock. We’ve known that for about two decades now.

    The question is why they are targeting MSMs when the disease isn’t even sexually transmitted.

  23. Skeptical Cicada says:

    So if it’s not sexually transmitted, why the fuck is NYC DOC scapegoating gay men?

  24. Spanner1960 says:

    I think it is you that is doing precisely that.
    Sticking one’s head in the sand whilst simultaneously taking it up the arse.

  25. Spanner1960 says:

    ‘MSM’ is standard nomenclature – it covers a whole multitude of sins, to excuse the pun.

  26. Spanner1960 says:

    As usual, people see two disparate events and assume they are connected.
    Fact: HIV pays no attention to one’s sexual orientation.
    Fact: HIV in Western countries is still the most commonly found in gay men.

    It is not the sexuality but the means of transmission.

  27. Spanner1960 says:

    I am am well aware of the religious right and their nasty, spiteful ways, but that still does not relinquish people from their own sexual health.

    To blame a bunch of preachers for making you have sex is totally ridiculous, and it is you who should be embarrassed if you support such a farcical notion. I have visions of all these sweaty men in New York darkrooms banging away saying “Forgive me Father for I have sinned.”

    Yes, I *am* putting the blame fair and square at the feet of gay men. Sure, we have plenty to contend with, and Americans get it far worse then we do in UK, we have the religious right, and we also have HIV spiralling out of control, but those two facts are not connected. It is typical of egocentric idiots such as yourself to call anybody straight that criticises gay people “homophobic” and any gay person “self-loathing”. Just because gay people are persecuted does not by default mean we are squeaky clean in the first place. You really need to give yourself a self-check and start recognising your imperfections, but then being a typical self-centered, vain gay man that can’t walk past a mirror, you think a quick rub of moisturiser will fix anything.

  28. Spanner1960 says:

    I can guarantee you still don’t get anything like the amount of poontang we do.

  29. Spanner1960 says:

    I was one of the few that made it through, but it left a void around my age range.
    You could go into bars and see guys a few years younger or older, but it was rare to find people like myself because they were all dead or dying.

    Unfortunately the drugs nowadays have have given people a false sense of security, and they somehow think it doesn’t matter any more. Fear has a very strong effect on one’s sexual practices.

  30. Spanner1960 says:

    Sorry. We don’t have currants in crumpets.

  31. JamesR says:

    Aah the dread Apostrophus Impudicus!

    Excellent to find at the end / beginning of this particular thread THANKS!

  32. JamesR says:

    No – the two forms of meningitis are different. The contaminated injection one is NOT contagious past the poor sots who received the injection. It’s nasty, mostly fatal, and FUNGAL.

    The contagious one is bacterial and probably a lot more common that they’re letting on as most people who get it don’t have all the symptoms – that 1 in 3 fatality is for those who develop symptoms. It has spread to all five boroughs, has been in the population all winter, when people share enclosed spaces more, and cough more,etc. I would assume it’s everywhere, and get the freaking vaccine. IF your doctor has it that is…

    Very hard to Google for info the standard way as all the returns are the Wingnuttishere going wild about The Gay and disease. Thanks NY Dept of Health.

  33. d3clark says:

    Not everyone. HIV+ MSM and MSM who have multiple partners from using apps, from bars etc. No recommendations for straight males or females, as yet. At least, these are the most recent recommendations that I’m aware of from the NYC DOH.

  34. JamesR says:

    It’s a bacteria.

    A once celled organism, probably a lot smarter than you.

  35. JamesR says:

    Your conditional charity is truly not heartwarming.

  36. d3clark says:

    Meningococcal meningitis is transmitted through the exchange of respiratory and throat secretions like saliva. Risk factors include: living in close quarters, kissing, sharing glasses/cups with someone else who has meningococcus. That’s why this spreads so easily in college dorm situations. Two people sharing a small room. Easy to pick up someone’s secretions on your hands and transmit to your mouth or nose. Some people may carry meningococcus and not be ill themselves. The bacteria are not spread by casual contact or by breathing the air in the same room as a person with meningococcal disease has been. So people in the same household, roommates, or anyone with contact with a patient’s oral secretions, meaning saliva or sputum, (parent, child, boyfriend, girlfriend, nurse, etc.) would be considered at increased risk of getting the infection e.g. mom can get it from taking care of her child who has it. So it’s not really a classic sexually transmitted disease unless you call kissing sex. Frequent handwashing can limit the spread of the disease in some cases.

    Close contacts of a person with meningococcal disease should receive antibiotics to prevent them from
    getting the disease. Vaccination can sharply decrease the risk of catching the disease. Vaccines seem to offer protection fro about 5 years, after which a repeat vaccination may be required.

    Symptoms include sudden onset of fever, headache, and stiff neck. It is often accompanied by other symptoms, such as nausea, vomiting, irritability, confusion, photophobia.

  37. Actually, the info released last fall is for HIV positive people only. This newest alert says everyone, regardless of status.

  38. JamesR says:

    You can get meningitis from being coughed on in the subway, on the street, a public restroom, etc. The vectors of some of the early victims of this particular strain are still undetermined. IE not fucking, but proximate contact, and some with no known direct contact at all. It can be asymptomatic in many if not most of those it infects, and can possible be transmitted by skin.

    I know how casually it can be transmitted, and I tried to get the vaccine and it was not available and my doctor was ignorant of it. This particular strain was known MONTHS AGO in one of THE largest and most transient cities in the whole fucking (and sneezing) WORLD. Now it has spread to all five boroughs, and how many people have died? Spread of these type of diseases progresses geometrically, with the first wave of the spread invisible

    Just ’cause you don’t have anal sex doesn’t mean you are not at risk for this particular bacteria – if I were straight or celibate I would want this vaccine, if I had any contact with the public at all. Magical thinking about statistics and STDs, when thrown about in a discussion of a disease that is NOT SEXUALLY TRANSMITTED is ostrich talk.

  39. d3clark says:

    “Many homosexual men are incredibly promiscuous, some having sex with hundreds of sex partners a year.” Are you talking about your personal dance card? If so, you might want to e-mail the Guinness Book.

  40. d3clark says:

    This info came out last fall
    from the NYC DOH. Though I haven’t seen any info in the lay press
    except for the HuffPo article. The CDC released info on it in January
    in the Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report.

    NYC DOH is recommending that physicians be alert to possible cases,
    look for signs and symptoms, report to DOH WITHOUT waiting for
    confirmation via culture and recommending off-label dosing of vaccine in
    some cases. Anyone can subscribe to the MMWR here, for free.… It often has articles on HIV and HIV-related diseases, among other things.

  41. JamesR says:

    Touché FLL!

  42. JamesR says:

    This reminds me of the MRSA ‘outbreak’ or spread that was blamed on gay male sex. Born and bred in hostpitals, and spread in locker rooms and, well, everywhere it was, initially, blamed on The Gay.

    Instead of canaries in the methane filled coal mines that is today’s communal petri dish of a society, we were exposed as typhoid Marys, somehow diseased from our Sin and depravity.


    The CDC / NY pubic health people have determined there are enough cases in the gay population to statistically predict it’s spread more there first – but the kicker – it’s NOT sexually transmitted! (Take that you stupid mouth breathing trolls. (You are just as vulnerable and not getting the vaccine.))

    Again: NOT SEXUALLY TRANSMITTED. In fact, they don’t quite know specifically how its transmitted, but it can be rather casually. I don’t know why they aren’t recommending more people get vaccinated (!?) unless they are trying to be cheap, there isn’t enough vaccine to go around, or they don’t want to start a panic. Just panic a smaller subset of the population. Or just hoping treating some will do the trick. Which doesn’t sound like erring on the side of real caution to me.

    This has been around for months – but for some reason, no one has raised a stink. !? again. News of this was coincident with a fungal meningitis outbreak due to lab contamination that affected steroid injections, killing those who recieved the treatments but nobody else. Confusion ensued, even among Doctors. They did not get the news… ? Thank You US Surgeon General. My Doctor was unaware of it a few months ago, thought it was the injection contamination, didn’t have the vaccine. This was in Florida, right before fucking TOURIST SEASON, when it has been known that people from New York sometimes show up in South Florida.

    Our public health system SUCKS. Whoa be unto us if / when we get some sort of mutant bird flu.

  43. d3clark says:

    stupidone (what an appropriate screen name you chose for yourself!),

    1. Gay men are being courted by some sperm banks and many are making deposits. Women are choosing donors based on intelligence, physical appearance, race, education/grades, business acumen, etc. So our genes ARE entering the straight population in this way. 2. Our semen can be used to fertilize ova from a woman donor, and the fertilized egg can be implanted in a surrogate. So we can have our own children. 3. And, of course, many of those children will be straight and pass our genes on to their children.
    Epic FAIL, stupidone.

  44. d3clark says:

    This info came out last fall from the NYC DOH. Though I haven’t seen any info in the lay press except for the HuffPo article. The CDC released info on it in January in the Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report.

    NYC DOH is recommending that physicians be alert to possible cases, look for signs and symptoms, report to DOH WITHOUT waiting for confirmation via culture and recommending off-label dosing of vaccine in some cases. Anyone can subscribe to the MMWR here, for free. It often has articles on HIV and HIV-related diseases, among other things.

  45. Makes sense. I was referring above to the odd way they list bars and parties, just seemed odd things to mention.

  46. You’re gonna die?

  47. BarbinDC says:

    I was working at Science magazine when the AIDS epidemic hit and we were the first to start publishing research papers on it. Because it was considered a “gay” disease, immediate attention wasn’t paid to it, thanks to St. Ronnie. Of course, no virus pays a bit of attention to the sexual orientation of its host and it didn’t take all that long for it break out in other, non-gay, populations. Bottom line here: EVERYBODY needs to get the vaccine. ASAP.

  48. Naja pallida says:

    Seems to me that the national STD rates speak for themselves. Louisiana, Georgia, and Mississippi are consistently among the worst for infection rates. Do you suppose a majority of people in those states would be “pro-marriage” types, or “promiscuous gay” types? What mathematically accounts for their rates being so much higher than say, Oregon or Massachusetts?

  49. FLL says:

    From your comment: “By the way, I don’t hate you, I feel sorry for you.” That’s false pity, which is a psychological defense from someone who knows that their side is losing. What a childish response. You watch defeat after defeat throughout the country for religious bigots like you, and you respond by saying, “I feel sorry for you.” You don’t even realize what a national joke you are, do you?

  50. FLL says:

    This is your most ignorant, self-important comment yet. Insofar as the Religious Right has sufficient clout, they can intimidate—yes, force—people to remain closeted, which has consequences that even a fool like you should be able to understand. If you are just too dull to figure out the obvious role of homophobic religious institutions in society, it would be best for you to leave the discussion before you further embarrass yourself.

    You seem to take real pleasure in exonerating Christian bigots who are guilty as hell. You seem so sympathetic towards them, but your sympathy doesn’t change the fact that they are rapidly becoming a hated minority in the United States. Does that upset you, by any chance? I suspect it does since your disdain is directly at gay men, not the Religious Right. Don’t you think people can connect the dots? You’re not fooling anyone.

  51. karmanot says:

    “the best way to avoid it was to surround yourself with fires.” or flies.

  52. karmanot says:

    “Just can not be any simpler then(sp) that.” I so agree. I wear mixed fibers, dine in a restaurant served by menstruating waitresses, eat shell fish and an occasional hooved animal, am disobedient to my parents, and have false idols like Huge Jackman on my bathroom wall. I am so into the filthy and sinful 21st century. The last Romans I read was a 3-way in the Borghese Gardens, just before closing time.

  53. karmanot says:

    “The math of promiscuity?” Were you that professor in Rocky Horror Picture Show?

  54. karmanot says:

    Run toward the twofer Matamala. Acts and Leviticus are already used up, but maybe The New Testament will wipe you clean.

  55. karmanot says:

    Just wash that thing honey and we’ll talk.

  56. karmanot says:

    “some having sex with hundreds of sex partners a year.” What about the other 160 days of the year? Maybe ‘they’ are out shopping, decorating, or just laying in wait to fag you.

  57. karmanot says:

    True, even Spanner’s own queen would not recognize her own queens. But then maybe that was because of professional jealousy rather than bigotry. I always appreciated a stiff upper lip on Brits myself.

  58. karmanot says:

    I bet you count the currents in your crumpet.

  59. karmanot says:

    “which generates anonymous sex.” Must be why closeted Christians coined the term ‘glory hole.’

  60. karmanot says:

    True, only Adam and Eve were born with original sin. God didn’t even mention gays, except to praise Abel’s’ lovely decorated altar, which was most pleasing in God’s sight. It was straight Cain who humped his Mommy and started mankind. Unless Adam and Eve had a daughter and then…..get my drift. Want to play Bible?

  61. Zorba says:

    Yes, K, sadness and tears. I still miss him.
    We lost some close friends back then, too, and I also miss them.

  62. karmanot says:

    Don’t take the bait SC

  63. karmanot says:

    Wear dark navy blue—-you’ll be OK. I’m serious.

  64. karmanot says:

    The number 2 next to wtf describes you in a nutshell (er nut job).

  65. karmanot says:

    You go trolletta, tell John what he thinks and see how far that gets you.

  66. karmanot says:

    But she does put the ‘SP’ monogamy on all her towels.

  67. karmanot says:

    Probably can’t get off that high horse Zorba, he’s stuck on the pommel horn.

  68. karmanot says:

    Damn, does that bring back memories and tears!

  69. karmanot says:

    Where’s Maria….bring it on B***H!

  70. dula says:

    You can have your own opinions. It’s when you try to legislate your “opinions” on a minority that the trouble begins.

  71. dula says:

    Gays are naturally selected to be Gay.

  72. dula says:

    Bacterial and viral meningitis are contagious… Both can be transmitted through droplets of respiratory secretions during close contact such as kissing, sneezing or coughing on someone…-Wiki

    Yeah, don’t get why they are focusing on only Gay men.

  73. Zorba says:

    Hahahahahaha! His/her brain is probably beyond redemption, SC.

  74. JG says:

    The Circuit Party, Grindr, bath houses etc etc are not cultural artifacts of a repressed, self-hating subculture. Gay men tend towards massive numbers of lifetime sexual partners, and condom use is nowhere near sufficient. This type of behavior spreads disease. Period. The fact of enormous lifetime sexual partners exists in every society and not merely in our own. It is a universal constant of male sexual desire when uninhibited by female K-selection.

    Gay men will always and forever have dramatically higher rates of STI’s than the general population. Period. Final answer. Full stop. Own it and don’t whine about Christianity. You’re a grown man now. What the hell is going to happen to you people when the antibiotics stop working? Best own this now.

  75. Zorba says:

    Exactly, Drew. That’s what I wondered, too. He/she must be living in some kind of nu-nu land.

  76. Zorba says:

    There’s a “normative” straight culture?
    You mean the one where straight guys have sex outside of their marriages, expose their wives to STD’s, and often ditch these wives for their younger mistresses? Like Newt Gingrich, Mark Sanford, Donald Trump, and any number of other straight guys? Or those who visit prostitutes, like Eliot Spitzer?
    That “normative straight culture”? Really???

  77. Whip says:

    If one lives a filthy and Sinful life they will die that way if they do not change. Read Romans 6:23 Just can not be any simpler then that.

  78. Ninong says:

    “Ancient doctors” believed that disease was caused by bad air and that the best way to avoid it was to surround yourself with fires.

  79. JG says:

    Don’t cry.

  80. perljammer says:

    I guess I should clarify. By promiscuity, I mean casual sex outside a committed relationship. Engaging in promiscuous sex is just asking for infection. Celibacy is not the opposite of, nor the only alternative to, promiscuity.

  81. Indigo says:


  82. Straightnotnarrow says:

    I’m sure this has been pointed out below, but if not…There is nothing about men who have sex with men that particularly increases risk for meningococcal infection (ergo this isn’t punishment from G-d). This organism lives in the nasopharynx and is spread through contact with secretions. Wether a sneeze or cough, a shared drink, or a kiss this bacteria is fairly easy to spread among closely proximated people.

  83. Skeptical Cicada says:

    The worst enemies of gay marriage are heterosexual bigots. That you don’t understand that simple fact tells us all we need to know about you.

    There is no big claim in the gay community that promiscuity is an “orientation,” nor do we use the offensive phrase “lifestyle choice.”

    You’re about a half a step out of your own anti-gay bigotry and are obviously grotesquely clueless about gays, the gay community, our norms, our language, our perspective, and just about everything else.

    Go try to lord over some other group you don’t know anything about.

  84. Skeptical Cicada says:

    LOL!! It’s hilarious that you imagine yourself so superior to gay men that you lord over us and fantasize that you’re in charge of straight culture.

    Oh, honey, climb off that high horse. The altitude is affecting your brain. You’re no better than the rest of us.

  85. W says:

    I have a friend who’s in public health, and so recently learned why this announcement doesn’t mention “gay” the way you do, but rather the “men who have sex with men [MSM]” construction. There are many MSM, especially in some minority groups, who don’t identify as gay. You may say that of course they are, but public health is all about figuring out what works with the population at hand…

  86. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Look another militant bisexual trying to bi-jack another thread. What a surprise.

  87. Skeptical Cicada says:

    The bit about hundreds of sex partners a year comes from a goofy 1970s “study” that has been debunked. Sigh. It’s almost better when religious bigots just stick screeching about God.

  88. Zorba says:

    I lost my beloved brother to HIV- AIDS at that time, Becca, and I clearly remember what it was like back then. He was the brother that I was closest to, and my husband and I were the ones he came out to when he was in college. He asked me not to tell our parents, and I respected his wishes.
    At his request, though, I was the one who had to tell our parents that he had AIDS. One of the hardest things I ever had to do in my life. Although not as hard as the night his partner (who we were close to) called us and asked about “letting him go.” He didn’t have to call us, since he had medical and legal power-of-attorney, but he wanted someone from the family to tell him that he was doing the right thing. Which we did.
    An unspeakably awful time.
    And may god, or whatever passes as god, or the universal force, or whatever, damn the trolls and haters who have crawled out of their slime to spread their ignorance and hatred. Fuck them all. And these self-righteous haters should also remember- karma’s a bitch.

  89. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Committed gay couples are not “playing house.” Take ownership of your bigoted mouth.

  90. I never knew it was a thing, in general, even before this. Also didn’t realize there was a pneumonia vaccine, which I got because of my asthma recently.

  91. Skeptical Cicada says:

    It’s funny. I would have thought English schools were better than you’re indicating at teaching reading comprehension. I said you need to take personal responsibility for what YOU say when YOU blunder into a foreign website and start spewing outsider condescension and then instruct us that we have to “appreciate” you. What’s the matter? Is it easier for your to lecture others about their need for personal responsibility than to be told how you’re lacking in it yourself?

    Roll up into an American blog screeching attacks right out of the mouths of the American religious right and expect to receive a hostile welcome, scold. BTW, the UK was hardly any big gay pioneer on relationship recognition, and if it weren’t for progressive Scottish MPs in the Commons, you wouldn’t be on the verge of the kind of marriage legislation that New Yorkers enacted a couple of years ago. So cut the cultural preening, Brit.

  92. Drew2u says:

    Given her record: nope, no shame.

  93. Drew2u says:

    straight people are monogamous?

  94. GAYHATER says:

    Africa is the only place with AIDS? News to me.

  95. Spanner1960 says:

    I hold no responsibility for you or your country, you blithering fuckwit.
    I am merely stating an opinion like anybody else here.

  96. Skeptical Cicada says:

    What are we watching and reading? The general response to your attack post appears to be a collective yawn.

  97. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Funny how STDs have been around forever. I guess that glorious pre-1960s past with no sex outside of marriage never actually existed.

  98. karmanot says:

    just kidding…..whooping cough is contagious and going like gangbusters through our county for the past few years. Mono mono…..

  99. Drew2u says:

    I feel bad saying “mentally ill”. Perhaps “psychologically ill” would be a better phrase?

  100. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Why must we appreciate anything? Where’s your “personal responsibility” to adjust to American norms when commenting on a blog that I think you’ll note is even called Americablog? Your opening comment was highly offensive. Take personal responsibility for that, troll.

  101. Drew2u says:

    lolbutnoseriously, pertussis is spread through the sharing of saliva, as far as my dorm room floor meeting was informed, years ago, when we were told someone on our floor contracted whooping cough and we all needed to be careful.

    I thought meningitis had a similar form of transportation and absent from – erm – polishing doorknobs after someone else, I don’t think that’s a viable method ;p

  102. Skeptical Cicada says:

    I don’t tend to pay much attention to condescending English scolds.

  103. karmanot says:

    What about a lap dance?

  104. Drew2u says:

    Wow, you’re really obsessed with this. Like, clinically so. Have you sought help?
    I don’t mean to disparage, but damn. It’s starting to sound like you have some deep psychological issues to work out.

  105. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Actually, your comment demonstrates that we can’t have a respectful dialogue without preening scolds like you spewing sanctimonious judgementalism. The assumption that enjoying sex is a function of hating oneself is your personal mental disorder for which therapy is available.

  106. Drew2u says:

    Point to where I talked about anything related to “promiscuity” because I certainly didn’t think anything I was writing was about that.

  107. karmanot says:

    Or door knobs! :-)

  108. Skeptical Cicada says:

    Thanks for the biblical exegesis, nutcase.

  109. Drew2u says:

    I thought it was like pertussis and could also be shared through communal drinking cups or toothbrushes, etc. ?

  110. karmanot says:

    “want full social acceptance by normative straight culture,” ROTFL social acceptance? Oh Please.

  111. karmanot says:

    It’s code for ‘moron’ Drew.

  112. karmanot says:

    Oh don’t I know dude, the Devil sucks.

  113. cleanupphilly says:

    If gay men want full social acceptance by normative straight culture, they are going to have to embrace the rationale for the norms of monogamy.

    Or you more than hurt your cause, you marginalize it better than any ranter against gays.

  114. cleanupphilly says:

    HIV is not the only disease out there. Even meningitis has a mode of transmission that is targeting unsafe behaviors in the gay community.

    Is it really realistic to try to argue for promiscuity as a life choice when there is little hope of a vaccine for HIV given its changing, hyper evolving nature? HIV shortens lives and quality of life. It’s nothing to play with, unless you like living on the support system that goes with it, which I can’t imagine anyone choosing over health.

    This is why the young and promiscuous have lost the support of people who lived through the plague years. After everything that has happened, people like me think anyone having risky sex is being deliberately ignorant, not making a “lifestyle choice.”

    You hurt your cause.

  115. karmanot says:

    “if it were not for the efforts of heterosexuals, the advances against AIDS would never have been achieved.” OMG, you just fell of the turnip hate truck.

  116. cleanupphilly says:

    There’s an explanation for social mores – yes, disease control is a likely explanation for a variety of social expectations, and it is not exclusive to gay men say. It very much includes everyone. Promiscuity is not considered a social good for all people across cultures, over time.

    Arguably this is the rationale for Leviticus. Disease control was observed, and drove the mores outlined in it. Only now are reasons observed in previous times for circumcision being found to have scientific validity in disease control. It is likely that ancient doctors observed some of this and guessed correctly.

    So it was for the crusade against straight promiscuity, which takes up most of Proverbs. The Bible occupies itself with the problem of heterosexual promiscuity much more so than any identifiably anti-gay position which are rare in comparison.

    These are ancient religious texts, so there was not going to be a modern response like healthcare. The drive for marriage, really an anti-promiscuity campaign, crosses time and cultures.

    Is it really wise to throw it all, the whole thing, out and start over with nothing? I believe your own grandmother would agree with me. Not out of hate, but because she loves you.

  117. Drew2u says:

    I love their first posts being so wall-of-text with bad grammar and junk science that, when called out on it, their next reply is usually a sentence long and a derivative of, “die fag!”
    Makes me wonder who pissed in their gene pool…

  118. Everyone should be vaccinated anyway. Both my bf and I were vaccinated against it in 2007.

  119. Drew2u says:

    Africa is full of “fags”? News to me.

  120. karmanot says:

    The apostrophe is a symbolic insert representing my middle finger to your vastly superior education. It stands both in both public and private occasions whenever you come to mind.

  121. Drew2u says:

    The louder they are, the further we’ll win.

  122. Drew2u says:

    Obama-fist-bump! (just to drive the insanity of the crazies even further) ;)

  123. It’s spreading through sex. It just happens, I suspect, that a gay guy got it first. But it could easily spread to the straight community if a man had sex with a man then had sex with a woman, so I am intrigued that they’re not warning others too.

  124. wtf2 says:

    “Nazis” is spelled without an apostrophe. The apostrophe indicates possession. It’s not entirely your fault you’re poorly educated, but you should at least try to keep up appearances in public.

  125. Drew2u says:

    Hopefully it’ll no longer be a death wish now that not only a baby but almost a dozen people (I think the numbers are up to) have been essentially cured of AIDS.

    Also, I think the new generation – my generation born during or after the AIDS epidemic – don’t understand the gravity of what happened during those periods. At the same time, I think that also plays into the “You’re old-age after 30” stereotype – I don’t know how many young gay men died before 30 because of the epidemic.
    At the same time, know just how our predecessors took care of their loved ones and one another should be something talked about and learned about in GSA clubs, PFLAG meetings, etc. but I don’t believe anything like that is happening. This/My generation is growing up thinking AIDS is just another STD/STI. We take for granted what our forebearers fought for and experienced – just like any other current social group (labor, social security, environment, etc).

  126. cleanupphilly says:

    The math of promiscuity without protection makes it inordinately more risky. It’s just not worth your life. I’m surprised to see so many posts defending quickie anonymous hookups as some kind of “lifestyle.” No, your orientation is your life, but risking your life is death.

  127. Spanner1960 says:

    Because people want to blame anything but themselves.
    Did the fundies force these guys to screw like rabbits? Did they compel them to have unprotected sex? Did they demand that they didn’t bother getting regularly tested?

    Stop trying to transfer the blame when it is totally apparent (and it would be laughable if it wasn’t so sad) that gay men refuse to accept responsibility for their actions.

    Nobody is judging people for being promiscuous, but at least have the balls to admit that it is a personal obligation for people to manage their own sexual health and quit blaming all and sundry for ‘making them do it’.

  128. wtf2 says:

    Ha! Too funny. You’re great. Live for your grandmother.

    Yes, disease control is the driver. That’s why we’ve always had universal healthcare.

  129. cleanupphilly says:

    Theoretically it could affect anyone with the right exposures, but it is appearing in gay men who are in what old fogies call the bath house culture. This was why SF shut down the bathhouses, btw.

  130. karmanot says:

    That’s what the Nazi’s thought too.

  131. cleanupphilly says:

    I was a nurse through the AIDS crisis, and I can’t believe that there is still anonymous hookups of unprotected gay men, now using apps.

    That’s just a death wish.

  132. cleanupphilly says:

    There’s a case to be made for monogamy (marriage) in any orientation. Consider that the worst enemies of gay marriage are gay men who choose promiscuity and claim it is just one more “orientation” and a perfectly valid and equivalent lifestyle “choice.”

    Then when such guys get sick, they are treated with the same regard as straight men who “bring home a disease to the wife” have been treated historically. Is that really anti-gay bigotry? I think it is arguable that there is an anti-promiscuity bias in all cultures, and disease control as always been the driver.

    It’s more likely that grandma will come to your gay wedding, less so that she will approve of you trolling for anonymous hookups on Grindr or Adam4adam. The reason is because she loves you, worries about you, and wants you to be healthy. It’s not because she hates you.

  133. wtf2 says:

    Thanks, Vag. Have fun whacking off to porn safely nestled in your man cave while wifey’s upstairs with your offspring. You won’t be getting any fresh pussy ever again, but that was your choice.

  134. karmanot says:

    But FLL, we have Rocky and Bullwinkle on our side!! Boris and Natasha they bees gone!

  135. AdmNaismith says:

    How is meningitis, even this strain of it, only affecting gay men?

  136. Spanner1960 says:

    Well, you must appreciate I do not live in a country where 80% of the population believe in God. To me, these people are more of an irritation than any kind of difficulty.
    My relationship is precisely that: functional, stable and open – and anybody that thinks they can interfere with myself or my partner’s life is sorely mistaken.

    That said, in the UK it is now the religionists that are in the minority, and it is they who are feeling the squeeze. Same-sex marriage is very much on the cards, and hate-speech will not be tolerated. Unfortunately you have everyone from the Westboro Baptist Church downwards pleading the first. We simply won’t stand for that kind of abuse here.

  137. karmanot says:

    Could be She wants to take us off this hell of a world you created.

  138. karmanot says:

    Oh come on now…admit it. You wanna a little wet and sloppy Slurpee.

  139. karmanot says:

    Not really, we shoplifted our sin. There was no price.

  140. karmanot says:

    ROTFL They think YOU are old?

  141. Yep, it’s a fine line between letting some of these losers hang themselves by their own words and letting things go too far. So far, folks are chewing them up nicely :)

  142. cleanupphilly says:

    The most boring people in the world are the dead ones.

  143. That’s what I meant when I wrote that the advisory was written in a bit of an odd way.

  144. BeccaM says:

    Yeah, you’ve said it. I remember what it was like in the early to mid-80s — back when a gay family member of mine lost his partner to HIV — and this feels like deja vu all over again.

  145. karmanot says:

    Wow, that’s quite a stew of bad English. Let me confess, during my active days I tried to conceive at least three times a week and at least that many times on the weekend, but it was god’s will that I didn’t. I am just so grateful that the dominant heterosexual society because of my inherent dignity commands you respect for my existence and condition.

  146. karmanot says:

    Biologically, non-gays are programmed….. wrong

  147. karmanot says:

    Totally and knuckle knock

  148. FLL says:

    When you read my comment, you’ll see that I’m in no way claiming that you’re some Bible-believing Christian. My only criticism was that you didn’t see the correlation between the hostility/political power of fundie Christians and increased difficulty for same-sex couples to have lives that are functional, stable and open. I always thought that correlation was very plain to see.

  149. karmanot says:

    If not more active, then certainly more skillful.

  150. karmanot says:

    Go to your nearest Akbar and have a Gin and Tonic.

  151. Spanner1960 says:

    You assume far too much.

    1) I am not American, I am English.

    2) I am a 100% dyed in the wool atheist.

    3) Marriage has NOTHING to do with religion – it is simply a legal and socially accepted recognition of a committed relationship between two people. Marriage was around long before the Abrahamic religions claimed it for their own.

    4) I am totally in favour of same sex marriage, because I am in the closest thing to one that my country currently allows, called a Civil Partnership. I have been “married” to another man for over five years.

    Bible-bashing Christians (and Jews and Muslims) do not intimidate me in the slightest, and never have, and on the odd occasions they have confronted me I have sent them running with their tails between their legs.

  152. AnitaMann says:

    Ahem. “Intimate contact with men met through a website”??? What about semi-intimate contact with someone met at a baseball game? Highly invasive contact with someone met at Costco? Could they tell us exactly how it’s transmitted? Unprotected anal sex is one thing; kissing is another. If it’s the latter, this thing will spread beyond gay men and the NY boroughs by Easter. Details, CDC!

  153. karmanot says:

    And away we goooooooo

  154. FLL says:

    If Bible-believing Christians have enough clout, they can (to some extent) intimidate people into remaining closeted, which generates anonymous sex. Your first comment shows that you don’t understand that, although it’s pretty obvious to most Americans. John Aravosis must be guessing that you’re not really comfortable with marriage equality. So let me describe the possibility in which John is wrong:

    (1) You don’t think fundamentalist Christians have any negative effect on the ability of two same-sex partners to live together openly and have a stable life.
    (2) You’re totally in favor of marriage equality.

    Somehow, this possibility just doesn’t add up. There’s a credibility gap. Unless you state that you think the prohibition on same-sex marriage is stupid and should be tossed out, I’m not convinced.

  155. Spanner1960 says:

    It’s no stereotype, it’s a simple fact.
    *All* men are naturally promiscuous – it is part of their nature to spread their genes as far and wide as possible. Women however, are the ones that end up carrying the kid for 9 months and then bringing it up, so they are a lot more selective as to who they sleep with, hence the old adage about a promiscuous man being a “horny devil”, whereas a promiscuous woman is simply a slut. Straight men’s sex lives are controlled to a large extent by women; they are the ones that define when the men can sleep with them. Women look for long-term commitment – as Billy Crystal once said in ‘City Slickers’, “Women need a reason to have sex, men just need a place.”

    When the model is tipped upside-down where men fancy other men and no women are involved, then the sex goes through the roof, but long term gay relationships are more difficult to maintain, whereas lesbians are the opposite, and have less random sex, but often bond with one partner for life.

  156. BeccaM says:

    Thanks. Even as I’ve become more hopeful for the future of LGBT civil rights — with things like the complete reversal to majority support for marriage equality and general societal acceptance — then comes something like this, not just one but a whole bunch of homophobic bigots unashamed to spread their hate and ignorance, and it makes me literally sick to my stomach to read their remarks. It’s clear we have a long way to go before such attitudes aren’t just in a shrinking minority, but also deemed unacceptable socially.

  157. Spanner1960 says:

    Why am I?
    And since when did getting married prevent people from having extramarital sex?

  158. Some of them I banned myself, but let their comment stand since it provoked discussion and was good evidence of my point, that the haters would use this as proof. But I’ll tell the mods to keep an eye out.

  159. Jose Escobar says:

    you know, we can all have a respectful debate about sex and traditional relationships and such, without attacking each other. of course we should all take personal responsibility and learn from our mistakes. it still doesn’t mean that there has been a culture around gays that has led many of us to hate ourselves, do things that are harmful to ourselves, and disregard our own well being. that’s a fact. when you grow up with a society that puts you down, it has an effect on you. that being said, things are changing and society is becoming more accepting. and hopefully that will change attitudes about ourselves. we are our worst enemy when we judge ourselves and others in our community.

  160. Drew2u says:

    Who is ‘m’? Why is is it ‘the devil’s mouth’? Why is the paragraph before last (night?) straight for ‘m’? Is the paragraph just not gay-for-m?

  161. wtf2 says:

    No, with all due respect, you’re confusing what you wrote in those 2 paragraphs with what you think. You’re revising. Those two paragraphs state that promiscuity amongst gay people is a result of “millenia of intolerance”, not a clear-eyed choice. I’m glad you’ve clarified your position now, but that is not what you wrote in the article. The rest of your comment about “taking offense every time” is BS meant to distract from the fact you were not careful in your writing and I think you’re smart enough to know it’s BS.

  162. Drew2u says:

    Lang-Nerd High-Five!!

  163. Kenny Don't says:

    Can’t wait for YOU to die of aids or some other fag disease. Why don’t you go have a man to woman talk with your dad. I’m sure he’s real proud. Oh thats right, he disowned you.

  164. Drew2u says:

    I was born in the middle of the AIDS crisis, so I don’t know what that was like. That is another reason why we need a history book to document all these instances of what Family and Community meant and means.

  165. BeccaM says:

    Seems to me they should be urging everyone in the area who is sexually active to get the vaccinations. ‘Exclusively gay’ and ‘exclusively straight’ isn’t the norm it was a generation ago, and given meningitis, unlike HIV, can be spread simply through kissing, it isn’t likely to stay contained to the gay male demographic for long, particularly given the prevalence of ‘on the down-low’ sexual activity in some social groups.

    And John? I think unleashing the moderators to deal with the swarm of bigoted comments below would be a good idea.

  166. Yet I had a bisexual group in NYC attack me for being old. Perhaps we all have something to learn from this experience.

  167. But he’s a sexy devil.

  168. I’m not responsible for the fact that I can’t get married. In fact, you are.

  169. Spanner1960 says:

    Gay activists. ;)

  170. Spanner1960 says:

    “A culture that taught them from an early age that they would never find romantic love…”
    BLEEURGH!! Get me a sick bag!
    ALL men are sluts. Fact.

    It just happens that gay men have the opportunity to put it about more than straight ones.
    Stop trying to slap the ‘poor me’ persecution complex on your sexual proclivities and face up to reality.
    Everyone likes to shag around when they can, so stop blaming others for your actions and accept the responsibility. You and you alone are responsible for your own sexual welfare; ignore it at your peril.

  171. No, you’re confusing a statement of facts with judgment. I’m the first to admit that celibacy for all would cure every STD in the world. It doesn’t mean I think it’s a good idea. See, fact versus judgment. To suggest that monogamy can be healthier in terms of STD transmission is fact. No one is saying that we should all therefore settle down into a relationship (as if it’s possible to do so by simply clicking one’s heels), or else you’re a bad person. But I do think that this attitude of taking offense every time someone tries to figure out how AIDS, for example spreads doesn’t help any of us figure out how to solve these problems. Everything in moderation. And the corollary, which is, yes Virginia, sometimes you can go too far in one direction (celibacy) or the other. It’s not hateful to acknowledge that fact even if haters try to use that fact against us. We need to be able to discuss these things openly, without attacking each other, or people are going to die. I knew some of the sex panic folks would panic over this post, the same way I knew that the religious right bigots would have a field day with it. But I wrote it anyway because saving lives is more important than making either group happy.

  172. I didn’t say sexually active, which I think is kind of a pseudonym for promiscuous. I wrote non-monogamous. I suspect there is truth that single people have more sex partners than married people or at least people in a long-term relationship. It only makes sense that they would, even if you taking cheating into account.

  173. Actually, no. That fact sheet you list to from late last year is only for HIV+ men. The risk has now grown, and they’re recommending ALL non-monogamous gay men get vaccinated immediately. So, it’s not old news, it’s actually worse news.

  174. wtf2 says:

    No, those paragraphs bolster the traditional heterosexist argument that monogamy is better than promiscuity and that gay people are damaged. It’s tired, wrong and boring.

  175. Sorry, Mary, but you dont get credit for helping fight AIDS. As I noted above, you do get for helping feed the kind of hatred that helps diseases like this spread.

  176. Actually, I had plans to kill myself by the age of 30 because it was made very clear to me as a kid that I was evil, smitten by God, and that if I came out I would lose my family and my friends and my job. And it was also made clear that I would never find love, because gay people don’t love, they just have promiscuous sex. And, if you get lucky enough to find love, your family, friends and job will find out and cut you off. So, I’m sorry, but yeah, that kind of culture imposed on a kid absolutely positively affects your ability to have relationships, sexual and otherwise, with anyone.

  177. I already googled that before I wrote the piece, and the stuff I found wasn’t nearly clear enough as to the specific mode of transmission. Oh they explained something, but it was still vague. Will google some more now.

  178. wtf2 says:

    What he wrote, and which you reiterate, is that people are promiscuous as a result of bigotry. In fact, some people are promiscuous because they choose to be–because they enjoy it; because it is not natural for humans to form lifelong monogamous sexual relationships.

  179. Actually, if you sleep around it’s because you’re single. Not to mention, you insist that gays not be permitted to marry, but then you also insist that they settle down and stop “sleeping around.” How exactly does that work? What I found ironic is that you can still hold both hateful opinions at the same time – how dare you try to marry, how dare you have non-monogamous sex! I think what you meant to say was “how dare you breathe.”

  180. Their mental illness must be god’s punishment for something they did :)

  181. God gives you breast cancer too, and he gives children muscular dystrophy. So, unless you think everyone who gets cancer, or any serious disease, is being punished by god, you might want to stfu and have a nice day :) Though thanks for proving my point in writing the last two paragraphs!

  182. And what sin are AIDS babies paying for? And kids with leukemia? And women who have breast cancer?

  183. Second last? YOu mean second to last?

  184. Clearly the city had some reason for phrasing it that way – I think it was their way of making it scarier for folks who might say “I don’t sleep with that many people” – this way it’s not based on being “promiscuous” but rather “oh you slept with someone you met online, or at a bar, the city says that means you have to get a shot.” This makes it logically easier for people, well and harder for them to wriggle out of getting the shot. I guess.

  185. Rickishay says:

    I think they are talking about meningococcal meningitis, which is bacterial (I’m not a doctor).
    From Wiki, both viral and bacterial meningitis can be transmitted through casual kissing (Bacterial and viral meningitis are contagious; however, neither are as contagious as the common cold or flu. Both can be transmitted through droplets of respiratory secretions during close contact such as kissing, sneezing or coughing on someone, but cannot be spread by only breathing the air where a person with meningitis has been.)
    From WebMD: Meningococcal bacteria may cause infection in a part of the body — the skin, gastrointestinal tract, or respiratory tract, for instance. For unknown reasons, the bacteria may then spread through the bloodstream to the nervous system. When it gets there, it causes meningococcal meningitis. Bacteria can also enter the nervous system directly after severe head trauma, surgery, or infection.

  186. FLL says:

    Wherever the Religious Right still has clout, they can intimidate people into being closeted, which is synonymous with anonymous sex. Can you explain why that suggestion is laughable? It seems logical to me.

  187. ahmed said says:

    that statement you quoted is straight form the devil’s mouth. its like a women that cheats on her husband and says I wasn’t happy with him. no don’t cheat solve the problem even if it means to part ways but don’t breach a trust like that

  188. wtf2 says:

    Married gays might very well end up living as long as married straights, but, man, are they boring. And I don’t believe I’ve seen any social unit as selfish as a married couple, except maybe one with kids. How many atrocities are excused in the name of “family”? How many self-righteous sociopathic businessmen–and now women–have I encountered who rape and pillage to “provide” for their family? Jesus and Buddha warned about that shit. As did Edith: “I worry that you’ll work in an office. Have children. Celebrate wedding anniversaries. The world of heterosexual is a sick and boring life.”

  189. Indigo says:

    Thing is, that second last paragraph you wrote is unwieldy. Rewrite.

  190. nicho says:

    Given Sarah’s family’s history, I hope even she would have enough shame not to preach about monogamy.

  191. Indigo says:

    It’s an STD?

  192. ahmed said says:

    the paragraph before last is straight for m the devil’s mouth

  193. nicho says:

    Interestingly, and sadly, the hate and ignorance we’re seeing here today is the same stuff w saw 30 years ago about AIDS. These pathetic haters are like cockroaches. They just hide in the woodwork until they sense some crumbs to feed on.

  194. Blogvader says:

    I’m straight and very sexually active, so I generally get a little chuckle out of hearing Christians say these things. Fortunately for me, people only care about promiscuity and sluttiness if you’re not a straight guy.

  195. Well, it’s not possible for everyone to be in a monogamous relationship – if you’re single, it’s hard to be monogamous when there’s no one to be monogamous with. And marriage isn’t for everyone. So I appreciate all of those arguments from folks who say we don’t all have to be married. I do think that prejudice has forced our community into a situation where we are likely less paired off than other communities (I’d be curious to see the data), and that doesn’t help with things like STDs, it makes it harder,

  196. nicho says:

    Actually, quite mentally ill.

  197. nicho says:

    I think so, but only because women provide the brake on straight men. Most of the straight men I know think about sex constantly and would have sex as often as they could if women were willing. I knew a guy who worked in a clothing store for young, “hip” guys. All the sales guys were young, hip straight guys. Periodically, a certain young woman would come in and go to the back room. All of the sales guys — married and single — would go back one at a time for a blow job.

  198. Doesn’t even have to be promiscuity. I didn’t say promiscuity. I said “non-monogamy.” There’s a difference. If more gay people were married, and there would be more married gay people without the eons of bigotry (and laws against it), there’d be a smaller pool of non-monogamous people, and it could be argued that diseases like this would have a harder time getting around, period. It’s a bit like suggesting that condoms, or celibacy, don’t help stop AIDS – they do – that doesn’t mean I’m a celibacy advocate. It does mean that it’s a fact, the few people having sex with more than one partner, the less things like this spread. I simply suspect that our community has more people in non-monogamous (again, it’s not the same thing as promiscuity) relationships because we were taught from a young age that we were bad and would never be in a relationships.

  199. FLL says:

    And the Republican Party is just beginning to implode (or even more shockingly, reverse it’s homophobic politics). Have fun watching.

  200. nicho says:

    I agree, John. How you meet someone makes no difference. Why the epidemiologists think it’s important is that anonymous contacts make it hard for them to track the disease. But it doesn’t matter whether you meet someone online, at a bar, at an embassy dinner, in a park, at your church’s Wednesday night prayer service, or at your cousin’s wedding. Contact with an infected person puts you at risk.

  201. FLL says:

    Does losing elections count as paying a price?

  202. FLL says:

    The majority of your fellow Americans seem to have plans for fundamentalist Christians, which should not make you feel more loved or comfortable. Your Christian god hasn’t been helping you much recently. Why should that losing streak change?

  203. Actual monogamous relationships would bring an end to HIV/AIDS, all STDs, and a number of other diseases and conditions within a couple of generations. But, monogamous relationships would not be “cool,” nor would that be in tune with the “you’re a fool if you don’t have as much sex as you can with as many partners as you can” modern philosophy that is current. That is why STDs persist from one generation to the next generation and pose a risk to everyone in society. Because of the *******s out there.

  204. No, I meant the weird thing about online apps (I get), bars, and parties. Why not just say “sex with more than one guy”? I just found the bars and parties thing to be kind of fun, as, where else do you meet people other than the Internet, bars and parties? Walking the dog? :)

  205. Blogvader says:

    Is there really any truth to the stereotype that gays are any more sexually active than their hetero counterparts?

  206. Leaffall says:

    Your psychological damage is caused by the fact that what you do is immoral and perverted. If you sleep around it is because you are of low moral character, not because people disagreed with your way of life.

    By the way, I don’t hate you, I feel sorry for you. The real hatred will come from the gay community. Watch and read…

  207. And, there’s nothing wrong with not being monogamous – I’m single and I have no plans to be celibate. But clearly these diseases spread more easily when we’re not monogamous, and when you reach a certain critical point they spread – just as we saw with AIDS. That doesn’t mean everyone has to be monogamous. It does mean that we shouldn’t deny the fact that perhaps we are less monogamous in part because of the hatred that we’ve faced forever, and sadly it’s having some consequences. And in any case, it’s rebuttal to an expected attack from the religious right – better to respond to it up front then so to sit back, shut up, and let them run us down with this argument, which they’ve done better.

  208. FLL says:

    Drew2u suspects that some of the bigoted posters are not native English speakers. He’s right!
    I teach ESL at the college level, and there are lots of Russian immigrants here in South Florida who like the gay-friendly USA just fine. But let’s look at some of Boris and Natasha’s English from the commenter “anotherview.”

    The homosexual agenda [are] trying to equalize the non-equal [inequality] (the difference) between homosexuals and heterosexuals [which] promotes hoping and dreaming for a better day when homosexuality falls within the social, cultural, and biologic norms. This outcome deceives [is deceptive] because [it is] unachievable…No rational parent will [would] wish for that status for their adult child.

    Based on these errors (omitting “be” and relative pronouns, confusing the modals “will” and “would”, unusual adjective and noun forms), my guess is Russian. Thank you, “anotherview” (Boris and Natasha), for your narrow-minded thoughts, but many of your fellow Russians who have moved to South Florida disagree with you.

  209. stupidone says:

    You may sit anywhere you want on the bus, that doesn’t bother me – so why does it bother you so much that, if you sit beside me, I may get up and move? Isn’t THAT my right? And, by identifying the fact that infertile women can’t breed, you confirmed the last point in my post, so thank you for that …

  210. Kenny De says:

    You trolls really are pathetic .

  211. Well, what did you expect from ‘victimized’ gays? I mean, it always someone else’s fault for their woes. They never accept resonsibility for anything let alone their behavior.
    Get off the pity-potty and get yr shots!

  212. Maranyika says:

    Meningitis, HIV what’s coming next it seems God have his plans with this group!

  213. Russ Klettke says:

    Do your readers a service and provide some detail on how it is transmitted. If this is bacterial meningitis, it can be from something as casual as kissing. This is easier to transmit than HIV.

  214. SXSW ROcks says:

    U said it best!!!!

  215. Kenny De says:

    What a moron you dolts always use that incapable of breeding in order to denigrate and put us at the back of the bus. Fuck you dude there are also women who cant breed its called being infertile . :P

  216. Kenny De says:

    Ya mean the way you are by discriminating? Funny I never read anything about your GOD saying that was a CHRISTIAN thing to do. Dumbass.

  217. vageorge says:

    It appears there really is a price to pay for having a sinful nature

  218. JG says:

    “perhaps if generations upon generations of gay men weren’t brought up in a society that did not permit them to marry”.

    Nothing is stopping gay men from being in monogomas relationships. Nothing. Back in the 80’s, gays celebrated their status as vanguards against the chains of marriage. Then AIDS. Now the story is that gays all along wanted to play house. Nothing stopped them from playing house.

    You all can marry all you want, far as I’m concerned. None of my buisiness. However, I need to set something straight: Unless the male sex drive is dramatically changed, the prevalence of STI’s among gay men will always be higher, even if y’all are all married off.

    This is all very simple. Get vaccidated and use condoms. Take ownership of your particular set of incentives (sex drive) and contraints (statistically higher likielyhood of STI’s from anal sex).

  219. stupidone says:

    Biologically, non-gays are programmed (read: naturally selected) to find gay behavior distasteful/gross/whatever. It is unnatural. It doesn’t propagate the species. We want to stay away from the odd, and gravitate to the normal. It’s biological, which becomes social, and can surface in our morals. So, why beat up the vast majority of people?! Gays are ODD, always have been, always will be. Gays have always been at the same percentage of human population and always will be. There is no hope for them, biologically, to ‘expand’. It’s not possible. Get over it. And, certain diseases will always go through the gay population in a more devastating manner. Resistance to same-sex-to-same-sex contact diseases can never be developed, refined, or passed on though the population or our ancestors because: 1. You are and will always remain a SMALL percentage of the population. and 2. YOU DON’T BREED! So, none of the stronger immune resistance traits among you(those with strong/unique immune systems who survive) can be passed on; they die with that generation. This is biology and math – not morality and religion – so stop trying to hold groups accountable for events within your group that they can’t possibly be accountable for!!! Also, intelligence (I don’t mean ACTING intelligent) is also a trait that suffers in isolated biological taxonomies – so, they probably won’t get this.

  220. nol007 says:

    I think it should all be blamed on social media apps which in my opinion should be called anti-social media apps. These apps have made it very easy for gay guys to hookup anonymously with all the health risks involved in this type of practice. These apps are destroying monogamous relationships among gay men. I do not agree that using these apps is like going to the bar. It takes a lot more effort to meet someone at the bar. The recent rise in all sort of STD’s among gay men including HIV, Syphillis, Resistant strains of gonorrhea, and most recently deadly meningitis is to be blamed on these hookup sites. It is the duty of the health department to trace epidemic of any disease to the source, which is going to be the social media apps(Grindr, Scruff, Adam4Adam, and the list goes on). It is the government responsibility to protect the citizens from these predator apps and shut them down permanently.

  221. Kenny De says:

    The sinners are dumbasses like you self righteous one. :P

  222. rerutled says:

    I think his point is that a culture of promiscuity is a result of the societal context of bigotry, which made maintaining life-long relationships extremely difficult. I think that’s a reasonable proposition.

  223. vageorge says:

    The gays are just beginning to pay the price for their sin

  224. Many homosexual men are incredibly promiscuous, some having sex with hundreds of sex partners a year. When one engages in that kind of behavior, what would one expect. This is a matter of personal accountability for homosexuals and not the fault of anyone else. And if it were not for the efforts of heterosexuals, the advances against AIDS would never have been achieved.

  225. Slawburger says:

    i really hate to think what bloomburg is going to do with this

  226. Sarah Wells says:

    Interesting. You could be on to something.

  227. Medically speaking, this is “old” news. Here is the NYC Health Department press release from the first week of October 2012

  228. Sarah Wells says:

    Yeah, that was weird. I’m sure many of the afflicted are well out, have accepting families, the capacity to love and know they do, and the ability to pick one and only one and settle down

  229. perljammer says:

    Really? Homophobic hatred is the root cause of gay promiscuity? Tell me, what is the cause of straight promiscuity?

  230. The disease started with a woman.

  231. HereinDC says:

    This weekend in NYC is the Black Party. Lordy, that meningitis is going to be spread all along the East Coast after this weekend.

    I’m being serious.

  232. Kenny De says:

    I agree with that its bad enough we deal with bigotry but to be bigoted towards EACH OTHER from the same community is even worse. Thats just hypocritical right there period.

  233. Kenny De says:

    I think Sarah Palin is posting over and over here.

  234. Eli says:

    “If anything, hatred and bigotry helped fuel this disease more than anything else.”

    Coming from someone who publishes hate and bigotry towards bisexuals.

    Pundit, heal thyself!

  235. Kenny De says:

    I bet you are also religious eh dumbfuck? Go back to your bible and act like a self righteous hypocrite thats all people like you ever do to begin with. :P

  236. Kenny De says:

    its not a condition your kinds hatred and bigotry is a CONDITION one that is YOUR faults not ours.

  237. Drew2u says:

    Brace yourself like they do against their drunk uncle. They know they’re losing ;p
    I welcome their brand of insanity if just that it boosts this site’s numbers & ratings!
    Edit: there’s a particular weirdness to this morning’s batch. Any chance they’re from outside the U.S. / non-native English speaking? Can see Russia from their house?

  238. Kenny De says:

    Shutup dude us gay dudes are so tired of you insecure braindead primitive straight men who are always scratching your asses belching trying to see whos TOUGHER and MORE MACHO then the other guy bullshit. Just shutup already get over your insecurities you arrogant immature homophobic asses.I can only hope you pathetic bullies one day get your karma for the way you have ALL treated gay people transgenders bisexuals lesbians etc… Oh my bad I keep forgetting 2 women getting it on is HOTTTT but 2 gay men even giving each other a peck on the cheek is ewww abomination disgusting KILL the fags etc… God I hate you straight men and you asses bring it on yourselves for the way you all treat others in this world.

  239. liludallas says:

    You caught that one…so did I. The only thing missing is finding a way to blame it specifically on straight white men.

  240. Drew2u says:

    I’m sure your nearest mental health clinic will welcome you with open and loving arms. Run, Matamala! Run towards your salvation!

  241. Drew2u says:

    Methinks the lady’s speaking Palinese.

  242. Drew2u says:

    I hope you’re smart enough to realize that those paragraphs aren’t directed towards people like you who choose to not “settle down” as it were.

  243. Mike_in_the_Tundra says:

    Could you translate that into English? It’s really quite incoherent.

  244. Drew2u says:

    I’m sure you tell bullied kids to shut the hell up and man-up, too.

  245. HAHA says:

    Hurray for hatred and bigotry!

  246. nicho says:

    Well, the Christian hate brigade is out in full force today.

  247. New Yorker says:

    Actually, all over NYC there are gay doctors where we do tell our doctors we’re gay. If you’re looking to fins all the gays in one neighborhood, don’t come to NYC– we’re everywhere in this city. Mixed right in with everyday folks, in fact.

    Get vaccinated and use condoms. Avoid heavy drug use where you let your guard down. Otherwise, have fun and be who you are.

  248. anotherview says:

    The homosexual agenda trying to equalize the non-equal (the difference) between homosexuals and heterosexuals promotes hoping and dreaming for a better day when homosexuality falls within the social, cultural, and biologic norms. This outcome deceives because unachievable. After all, no heterosexual couple wishes its newborn child to grow up to live as a homosexual. Objectively, the ancient social and cultural norms rest on the biologic norm of procreation as a necessity of furthering the existence of the human race. Functionally, homosexuals of the same gender in a sexual relation cannot produce fertile offspring. Hence, heterosexual couples naturally want heterosexual children. Even if they did not, then they might consider the risks of homosexuality in getting various diseases (like AIDS and now a deadly meningitis) more readily than the general population. No rational parent will wish for that status for their adult child. Meanwhile, recognizing and accepting the difference between homosexuals and heterosexuals do not automatically result in discrimination toward homosexuals by the dominant heterosexual society. Instead, because of their inherent human dignity, homosexuals command our respect for their existence and their condition.

  249. cleanupphilly says:

    Frankly it is reasonable to extrapolate that the better health outcomes of married heterosexuals will be replicated by a cohort of married gays. It’s just mathematically safer.

    There is little argument to be made against it, and indeed, promarriage types who advocate marriage are hogtied into admitting that the positive effects of marriage cross class, race, and sexual orientation.

  250. cleanupphilly says:

    The meningitis outbreak is in all of the boroughs of NYC per previous news reports. You can find it under the health section of Google news, to confirm.

  251. mgardener says:

    The wording makes sense to me. If a man does not, for whatever reason, call himself a gay male, then he may disregard the warning.
    Advising all men who are sexually active with other men, rather then stating gay males, makes more sense.

  252. Matamala3 says:

    Unless you are having sex with gay men you are alright. I know gay men are shining beacons of cleanliness and are declared free of all diseases that infect us heathen heteros. Hopefully one day us white men will be enlightened like the gays, after all they stick it in other mens poopers, they are trancendent human beings that can’t be judged in any way. LONG LIVE THE TRANSGENDERS!!!

  253. Jim E Henson says:

    We were made this way,or so we are told.Who made the rules?Who cares what you do?It all screams look at me.Hey nobody cares get it.What you do well now, that’s just you.Gonna change the world for what?To be ever more depressing.What was the original sin,The Anunnaki know the fallen know,and if you think you know better than your creator By all means defy the rules I have seen the results.We are talking the real deal here,not your imaginary friend,Lots of luck new misery coming just for those

  254. Ptosis Theseus says:

    Is the is somehow related to the New England Compounding Center (NECC) that

    contaminated vials of steroids causing 15 people to die? The deadly outbreak amoung gay guys: How do they know this? Do you tell your doctor when go in for treatment? Nobody does that.

    There must be a local clinic that is mainly for gays and so that local area could be deadly for anybody – and not just gays. What nieghborhood should I avoid?

  255. Jon N. says:

    ” If anything, hatred and bigotry helped fuel this disease more than anything else.” – this is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. The religous right has their flaws, but to blame them for the contraction of a deadly disease is laughable. This is pandering at it’s most obvious form. I wonder, does the writer blame all his problems on other people, or is there any personal accountability left in this world?

  256. wtf2 says:

    Eh, your last 2 paragraphs were pretty weak. If only gay people were in monogamous relationships, everything would be better? And not being in a monogamous relationship is evidence of “psychological damage?” Count me out. I CHOOSE not to ape traditional, dull, conformist heterosexual relationships and I don’t need anyone’s approval.

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